Hi! I just wanted to ask, since you’ve done a lot on dwarven aging, what do you think about hobbit aging?

Hey there! Lovely to hear from you!

Luckily, there’s HEAPS of info here. Tolkien loved his fussy little Hobbitses, and gave them plenty of attention (unlike Dwarves, I am not bitter ~~I am bitter~~). So all this here? Is canon.

Hobbits age slowly, in comparison to Men. They come of age at 33 years old.

The period of their twenties is a wild and heady, irresponsible sort of time, known as the ‘tweens.’

For reference, during LOTR? Pippin is 29. (Yes, he’s not even an adult!!!) Frodo was meant to be a particularly rambunctious tween, who loved to steal Farmer Maggot’s mushrooms.

50 is literally their middle-age, as the average Hobbit’s lifespan is around 100 years old.

Bilbo is a VERY exceptional hobbit. He says at one point that his aim is to live longer than the Old Took, his grandfather Gerontius, who made it to 130 – and thanks to the Ring (and probably his own innate stubbornness) he made it to 131, before leaving for Aman where he would have eventually passed away.

Question: I know Oin is somewhat psychic, with the reading portents aspect, but do you think there are other dwarves who can do things like that? Burning chicken bones and reading the answer to questions in the cracks, or messages in the clouds like in ATLA? Or even ones, rare though they are, who can /see/ those who have died and sometimes help counsel those who have lost many loved ones and provide closure?

Hhmmmmmmm, excellent question, Nonnie. I had to put on my thinking-cap. Here’s what I came up with!

I think it’d be tremendously rare, tbh? Dwarven ‘magic’ tends to be far more physical and/or mechanical: invisible doors with super-tricky passwords, that sort of thing.

I haven’t ever seen ATLA, sorry!

The stuff we have on portents (which is film-verse only, and not from the books) is also pretty thin on the ground:

Gloin: “Aye, Oin has read the portents, and the portents say: it is time.”
Oin: “Ravens have been seen flying back to the mountain as it was foretold. When the birds of the old return to Erebor, the reign of the beast will end.”

The ravens are mentioned again at the end of AUJ:

Oin: A raven. The birds are returning to the mountain.
Gandalf: That, my dear Oin, is a thrush.
Thorin: Well, we’ll take it as a sign. A good omen.

Not much to go on!

Using these two bits of info, I guess that Dwarven ‘portents’ are very much based on the actions of the natural world. I also guess that any reading of signs would probably be done by Dwarves who have either been taught familiarity with ravens or other birds, or have spent a LOT of time outdoors, enough to be familiar with the habits and migrations of animals (Oin is very learned and is also an apothecary: he has to collect plants, after all!)

I don’t think that any living Dwarf can see the dead ones except under INCREDIBLY EXCEPTIONAL circumstances – hence, in Sansukh, Gimli only sees Thorin in Galadriel’s mirror or upon the Paths of the Dead.

Mandos rules the Halls of the Dead and has only ever changed his mind once (Beren). The mists between Middle Earth and Aman are impenetrable, and there can be no returning. The Halls of the Dead are even more inaccessible – they’re a world removed within a world removed. None can see the dead, unless they are horribly cursed (the ghouls of the Dwimorberg, the wights of the Dead Marshes, the Nazgul, the Barrow-wights), and thus still residing in Middle-Earth.

Again, in Sansukh, the only reason Thorin’s Gift works at all is because of a loophole (the

Olórë Mallë), Gimli’s extraordinary perceptiveness, the pool of Gimlin-zaram, and the compassion of a Vala – Aule himself.

When it comes to being comforted, Dwarves would know that after their deaths they are gathered to Mahal’s Halls and cared for there. They have absolute and personal proof of his love for them, after all – their dark names.

~~leaving all this aside, though: it has to be said that the idea of a Dwarf medium has a certain Pratchettesque humour about it~~

Do you have a list of favorite characters?

Nah, not really? I like a lot of characters (and many immediately spring to mind!) I like people with a friendly warm appearance rather than conventionally ‘sexy’ I guess, on the whole… and there are characters I admire (Dain) and others that I call SAD TRASHLORDS (Maedhros) and I love em all. Here’s a few, I spose! Just rattling some off the top of my head:

Dain Ironfoot
Gimli
Boromir
Faramir
Eowyn
Arwen
Galadriel
Maedhros

Bruce Banner
Pepper Potts
Bucky Barnes
Sam Wilson

Sam Vimes
Vetinari
Moist Von Lipwig
Susan Sto Helit
Granny Weatherwax
Cheery Littlebottom

Luna Lovegood
Minerva McGonagall
Rubeus Hagrid
Remus Lupin

…

Well, there’s four fandoms there… some faves of mine! I hope that’s all right, Nonnie!

so I’m pretty sure the data of Dis’s birth is cannon — is the date of her death also cannon? (if so, I can’t recall it, so I thought you might know.) and a general question about your writing process (which is amazing btw), is how you go about dealing with inconsistency or giant holes in cannon?

Hey Nonnie!

Yeah, the year of Dis’ birth is canon… but get this: there’s no date of death. Check the Line of Durin family tree (I cropped it a bit, to show the last four generations)!

SHE DIES IN YEAR ? OF THE ? AGE

Ooooh, boy. Well, there’s inconsistencies aaaaall the way through canon, oddly. To be fair, in a work of this magnitude, it’s nearly impossible for there not to be some clashes here and there. There’s Tolkien-changed-his-mind inconsistencies, Christopher-Tolkien-Has-Opinions inconsistencies, movies-vs-books inconsistencies, Silm-vs-everything-else inconsistencies… and the list goes on.

Basically, I pick the version I like the most/fits the best – or if there’s no information readily available, I make it up 🙂

Hello! I’ve been wondering, what’s your opinion as to why Groin and Fundin’s names are so dissimilar? Dwarf siblings seem to have theme names so often and all.

OH MY GOD I ACTUALLY HAVE A POSSIBLE ANSWER TO THIS

Groin seems to be a variant of a traditional Line of Durin name!!! Check out the family tree:

There’s been a King Oin and a King Gloin in the past. These names are tremendously repetitive and derivative, until you reach Borin. Then you have a bit of a departure in that branch of the family, and Fundin’s name seems to be derived in part from Farin’s.

Balin and Dwalin’s names also seem to be derived in part from Farin and Fundin.

But Groin’s seems to hark back to those old kings? Enough so that he is able to name his own sons after them, and they appear to be derivatives of his name, anyway.

So, there’s ONE possibility!

btw, this is totally disregarding Tolkien’s original source for many of these names, the Völuspá (the names Thorin, Thror, Thrain, Dain, Frar, Loni, Nar, Nain, Gloin, Dwalin, Balin, Bombur, Bifur, Bofur, Gandalf, Dori, Ori and Durin all came from this edda!)

hey dets!! I wanted to ask you if you knew of some good tolkien fanfictions with trans characters, aside from your Sansukh and Azhar??

Hey Nonnie! I have done my best – there’s a lot more than this, I know, but for some reason my google-fu doesn’t want to co-operate with me tonight. So if anyone wishes to reblog and add some more onto the end and help the Nonnie out, that would be greatly appreciated!

_{(I will first say, and I will do so every time: I am cis. I have created and I write trans characters (and my word, was I ever asked about it!!!) but it would be amazingly disrespectful and arrogant of me to write about being trans or about trans issues. And so, that is why I do not.}

_{Many of these authors are trans or nonbinary, and can write with personal understanding and experience about being trans and about trans issues. I recommend their work wholeheartedly.)}

I must first rec all the fic of @thorinsmut! Also everything by @asparklethatisblue (check out The Only Thing I Ask) and also

orphan_account! And finally – check out the work of @dain-mothafocka (unfinished, but OH SO GOOOOOOD).

(pssst – Also, the Must-See person for recs is @baggvinshield – check out her amazing reclists!)

Here’s the search for trans characters for The Hobbit on AO3, and here’s the one for LOTR.

Now, for a couple of fics I have read and remember enjoying:

Green Silk and Gold Lace by Mozzarella (transwoman Bilbo)

This Feeling That Remains by khazadqueen (ama)

A Tale of Two Drivers by mage_girl

Gimli’s Secret by thudworm

The liveblogs: @reclaimeddurin and @quiterespectablyyours (nonbinary Kili!)

Again, anybody out there with any recs for the lovely Nonnie, please don’t hesitate to add them onto this post! Thank you so much!

Hey! I was just wondering why you chose to make Narvi female? I’m not criticising you – I can no longer think of her as anything but female after Sansukh :P – but the LOTR appendices state that Dis was the only female dwarf whose name was shared in their histories, and that was because of the bravery of Fili and Kili. So, I was wondering – since Narvi is named, shouldn’t that mean that she was male according to Tolkien? Eh, just curious :P

I’m glad you like the notion, Nonnie! Here’s where I mention how the idea struck me. There is no gender-indicative pronoun used for Narvi in LOTR – though there may be one used elsewhere, i can’t remember and don’t really care, and here’s why:

I love Middle-Earth, and Tolkien’s incredible work, and especially Dwarves, okay, but I try always to be aware and acknowledge that Tolkien himself held catholic and patriarchal ideas about the place of women, and he was particularly repressive/dismissive when describing the place of women in his fantasy Dwarf society. As amazing as his achievements are, Tolkien failed women and girls back then. He absolutely failed to give equal – or even sufficient – representation. Women characters with spoken lines in LOTR can barely even be counted on two hands. There are NONE IN THE HOBBIT AT ALL. I can try and do something to change that: that’s the fun thing about transformative fanfic.

I am pretty sure if you re-read the above message you sent to me, you could pick out at least three reasons why I would write Narvi as a woman – not least of which is that there are quite enough men in this bloody universe already.

And so, yeah… I don’t really care if she ‘should’ be yet another man. She’s a woman to me – an impatient, sardonic, slightly haughty, incomparably genius black woman.

And tbh, my dearest Professor Tolkien, fuck the idea that women only matter to history because of the actions of their sons.

All this talk about dead people suddenly gave me a thought: what the heck happens to orcs when they die? Do they go to the halls of Mandos? Do they just cease to exist? Has this ever even been addressed?

Hey Nonnie! I had to go do a little bit of hunting, but I think I have found an answer… ish, from someone who has done WAY more research than me.

Tolkien apparently wavered a LOT on the whole idea of Orcs’ origins and subsequent afterlife. He once said, “And dying they would go to Mandos and be held in prison till the End.” He goes to a LOT of trouble to stress that they’re irrevocably evil, no question, and suggests that they have no fea (spirit/soul).

But it’s very open-ended and inconclusive, it seems, and so it’s pretty much up to you what to believe.

(I like to think that they are cleansed and reborn as the Elf they should have been, when the world is remade. Well, some of them. I can’t imagine orcs like Gothmog or Azog getting another chance.)

Sources here: @askmiddlearth‘s posts ‘Orcish Afterlife’ , ‘Orcs and Emotions’ and ‘Are Orcs Evil By Nature?’

emsiecat:

backgroundelf:

luthicn:

the tolkien fandom is dying and so am i

The Tolkien fandom shall not die!

Bloggers of tumblr, of fandom, my brothers! I see in your eyes the same fear that would take the heart of me. A day may come when the Tolkien fandom fails, when we no longer make fanart or fanfiction, and break all bonds of mutuals; but it is not this day! An hour of doubt, and no new media, when the Age of Tolkien comes crashing down; but it is not this day! This day we post! By all that you hold dear on this good internet, I bid you stand, Tolkien Fandom of Tumblr!

Nicely put my friend.

Folks this fandom has been going since the 1930’s, sure they didn’t have the social network advantages we do, but it was still there.

Point is, people will drift in and out, and new content will lessen now there’s no new media to draw inspiration from, but there’s no way we’re dying!

Personally, I’m not gonna sit here and despair if new fan art and fanfic are posted less, I’m just gonna take that as a sign to do my damnedest to post more myself. Even if it only ever gets one like or comment, just to know that someone out there us still with me in this wonderful fandom and still wants to see my stuff is more than enough for me.

You think the posts are less now? Do something about it then, we beg of you! Draw fan art, write that fic you’ve had in your head for months, even if you think it’s ooc or you can only draw stick people. Write us meta or head canons, reblog the hell out of stuff from 2012 or earlier!

Instead of decreeing the fandom is languishing, take up creative arms and fight!

psychopompious:

psychopompious:

psychopompious:

neverwondernever:

One of the things I like about Tolkien writing his series from the perspective of “its a translation from Westron” is that any time he uses ‘Christian’ speech (words like evil, dark v light motifs, demon–words that are specifically coded from what is a common view from Christian Europe) is that that doesn’t mean things were actual demons. He did what translators would do: write it to make sense to the people reading it. It also means that because we do not have the ‘original’ text (because it never existed except in his mind), we do not know what the proper words or descriptors are in Westron culture. We just know what the generic sense is, what its supposed to evoke.

This little part of his writing makes it so masterful. It means that we as fans are also given great freedom to read in between lines and fantasize as we like. It goes back to Tolkien’s comments on what fantasy is: fun. He provided us a translated text and it means we can create many variations from how we want to read the mysteries in between.

If one wanted to get even more meta about this, then there’s the fact that Tolkien suggested (repeatedly) that human languages had their basis in elven ones. According to his mythos, most humans first learned language and crafts from elves. And you can see this relationship continuing even into the later Ages, with human characters bearing the names of elves. Right up to “Ælfwine”, who supposedly transcribed much of the Silmarillion (and other assorted things) from Pengolodh, and whose name is a real life name which literally means “elf friend”.

So, what you have here is humans learning words and concepts from elves which they weren’t really equipped to understand. Because elves aren’t actually humans with pointed ears, they’re really quite alien, and experience the world in a completely different way. From the very beginning, you have humans basing their cultures around a fundamental misunderstanding, and this fundamental misunderstanding is transliterated and proliferated over thousands of years.

You could, technically, blame the very existence of most of the “Christian Europe coded” things on elves. Or rather, on humans who met elves and didn’t understand what the fuck they were saying but thought it sounded cool anyway.

I’m reblogging this with my own stupid tags because what’s the point of having a good tag rant if tumblr cuts it off:

talk to me about LaCE. and ‘sex’ and ‘marriage’ being literally the same word for elves. not necessarily because they were pro-abstinence puritans but. because elves are fucking telepathic. and that changes their perception of every goddamn social interaction period. and they bind inseparably. absolutely does not say they cant do this more than once. rather the opposite. also doesnt say that this happens the first time they have sex. or which kinds of sex acts cause bonding. does not say at all. but the very fact that this is a biological reality for them?. of *course* ‘sex’ and ‘marriage’ are the same concept to them??. it’s basically saying ‘we share ourselves utterly when we do this’. ‘because we’re telepaths’. ‘and sometimes that sharing becomes permanent and irrevocable’. but this is not a biological reality for humans. who misunderstand. because humans arent telepaths. they just misunderstand the elf concept of ‘marriage’. to mean that you SHOULD ONLY HAVE SEX AFTER MARRIAGE. AFTER A CEREMONY WHICH TO ELVES. IS PRACTICALLY MEANINGLESS??. i can just imagine an elf learning this and being like. ‘wait hold up back up a second’. ‘you guys seriously consider this ceremony’. ‘to be marriage’. ??? ??. ‘yeah how do you guys do it??’ says the human. ‘the ceremony is just a polite form of public recognition’ says the elf. ‘anyone who wanted to get married could just do that’. ‘but HOW’ says the human. ‘?? they marry?’ says the elf. ‘define marriage’ says the human. ‘the binding of two people together’ says elf. ‘okay that sounds the sa-’. ‘the physical act is a metaphor’ the elf continues. ‘oh’ says the human ‘i think i get it’ but DOES HE. DOES HE REALLY. =actual conversation between aelfwine and pengolodh at some point probably. as recorded in Laws and Customs Among the Eldar.

I’m reblogging this from myself yet again because it strikes me as an absolute TRAGEDY that no one has really mined this particular facet of canon for the wealth of cultural misunderstandings it offers, so I’m going to offer a few suggestions.

elf #1: I heard that humans actually marry in public, with spectators standing all around!
elf #2: oh, don’t be silly, they don’t marry like we do
elf #1: how do they procreate then?
elf #2: heavily ritualized but very brief skin contact, usually kissing
elf #1: that’s ridiculous
elf #2: it’s no more ridiculous than your theory!

human: hey friend, I wanted to invite you to be my best man!
elf: …? your what?
human: my best man! I’m getting married!
elf: !!!
elf: are. are you propositioning me.
human: what
elf: what

human: by the way, I’m getting married
elf: that’s nice, love is a great and wonderful thing
human: oh, I don’t really love him, you understand how it is, he can provide for me and my family
elf: wait, what?? i thought you said you were getting married
human: ???
elf: i don’t think we’re talking about the same thing

a human scholar, ripping their hair out hundreds of years later: this text says this historical figure married THIS person, and that one says they married THAT person, and I have a dozen more like this saying this same elf was married to a dozen OTHER PEOPLE??
human readers, millennia later: why are there so many blank spaces in the family trees?? who the fuck are the parents

I find that a fun exercise to do while reading any of Tolkien’s works is to replace any mention of “marriage” or similar (when in reference to elves) with “they had sex”. Because, well, it’s exactly the same thing. More literally than usual. Also a fun exercise: Remembering that elves “sleep” (for a given definition of that word) with their eyes open, and then imagining Beren or Tuor settling in for post-coital snuggling only to find themselves stared at, unblinkingly, all night.